Something's Gotta Be Done

Tip Credit is a federal law that allows employers to take a 'credit' against the minimum wage, and pay lower wages to employees who earn tips.

n00b
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Pizza Hut
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:15 pm
Hi all. My names JetAeroBurner. Been in delivery for almost a year. I have to say, I am floored by how little they pay us... The minimum wage is 7.25 for insiders and yet when you go out in your own car, on your own insurance, they drop you down to 4.25. I want to talk to whoever decided that this would suffice. Delivery and any sort of self transporting job is already marked in the top 20 most dangerous jobs, and we get thanked for risking our cars and our well-being by getting a 3.00 drop on our wages??? Not only is this a slap in the face for all driver's who risk their selves everyday, but it has caused a very dangerous ploy from the driver's I work with. I'll never forget my first experience as a ride-along. This man ignored a red light, drove the wrong way onto oncoming traffic, and nearly t-boned someone as he DRIFTED in a turn. When I managed to somehow find my stomach to ask him what the rush was, he said, "The sooner I get back, the sooner my pay goes up." This is the kind of direction this cutaway is leading us to. Something has gotta give, else I fear for not only the equality of the workers but for everyone's safety on the road. What should we do? Who do we contact to challenge this?
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2010 Ford Fusion
PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 4:11 pm
Welcome to the Board JetAeroBurner!

JetAeroBurner wrote:What should we do?


By reading and posting here, you've taken the first important steps. You have MUCH more to learn, and the hard work begins with YOU.

JetAeroBurner wrote:Who do we contact to challenge this?


Well, you've contacted us, and that's good, but alone we are unable to directly help fix your problems. Together we can help you learn and point you in the right direction, and help you figure out exactly which problems you want to address and what to do and/or who to contact to help resolve them.

I see that you posted in this subforum: "Laws and Legal Matters - Can they DO that? Is that even LEGAL? » Tip Credit / Pay Cuts", so I assume you have been reading here a bit. There is MUCH more to learn!

To learn a little bit about me (I run the place) I suggest that you read this:

How and why I became an amateur labor law expert:

I also suggest that you start reading any and all topics in all the 'legal' subforums that seem to be relevant to you:

Subforums:
Minimum Wage/Mileage Reimbursement,
Tip Credit / Pay Cuts,
Lawsuits against Domino's, Pizza Hut, and Papa John's,
Workmans Comp, Car Insurance,
Union and NLRB issues,
Tips and Taxes


Finally, what exactly is it you want to do? Slow down the speedy driver? Fight split pay/tip credit? What are the actual changes you seek? Are others at your store willing to help you? What state do you work in (so we know what laws might apply)?

Oh, and if you DO decide to fight back, it might be best if you posted under a pseudonym or 'fake name'. That way you do not 'telegraph' to your store or company what actions you are planning to take. If you decide to change your name here, just send me a PM with your new desired 'screen name'.

Take a deep breath and realize that most of this is a slow lengthy process, and YOU will become the one who does most of the work if you choose to act. That said, there are PLENTY of well informed people here more than willing to help anyone who is willing to learn and help themselves.

Thank you for joining us! Now get to work! :D 8-)
"If you ain't on the road, you ain't makin' money!" - gregster

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n00b
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:46 pm

Where do you work?:
Pizza Hut
User Type:
Pizza Delivery Driver
Car you drive:
Compact Car
PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 11:06 pm
gregster wrote:Welcome to the Board Joshua!

JetAeroBurner wrote:What should we do?


By reading and posting here, you've taken the first important steps. You have MUCH more to learn, and the hard work begins with YOU.

JetAeroBurner wrote:Who do we contact to challenge this?


Well, you've contacted us, and that's good, but alone we are unable to directly help fix your problems. Together we can help you learn and point you in the right direction, and help you figure out exactly which problems you want to address and what to do and/or who to contact to help resolve them.

I see that you posted in this subforum: "Laws and Legal Matters - Can they DO that? Is that even LEGAL? » Tip Credit / Pay Cuts", so I assume you have been reading here a bit. There is MUCH more to learn!

To learn a little bit about me (I run the place) I suggest that you read this:

How and why I became an amateur labor law expert:

I also suggest that you start reading any and all topics in all the 'legal' subforums that seem to be relevant to you:

Subforums:
Minimum Wage/Mileage Reimbursement,
Tip Credit / Pay Cuts,
Lawsuits against Domino's, Pizza Hut, and Papa John's,
Workmans Comp, Car Insurance,
Union and NLRB issues,
Tips and Taxes


Finally, what exactly is it you want to do? Slow down the speedy driver? Fight split pay/tip credit? What are the actual changes you seek? Are others at your store willing to help you? What state do you work in (so we know what laws might apply)?

Oh, and if you DO decide to fight back, it might be best if you posted under a pseudonym or 'fake name'. That way you do not 'telegraph' to your store or company what actions you are planning to take. If you decide to change your name here, just send me a PM with your new desired 'screen name'.

Take a deep breath and realize that most of this is a slow lengthy process, and YOU will become the one who does most of the work if you choose to act. That said, there are PLENTY of well informed people here more than willing to help anyone who is willing to learn and help themselves.

Thank you for joining us! Now get to work! :D 8-)
I wish to end this split pay. I would be content with just equality. 7.25 on the road would work fine for me. You need more than just tips to cover gas, mileage, and repair... Especially if a lot of customers stiff you out. I don't know about the others, as I haven't asked, but that guy who sped probably would be willing. I live in South Carolina in the Summerville area.
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Master Driver
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Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2009 10:40 pm
Location: Chesapeake, VA
Where do you work?:
Papa John's franchise
User Type:
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2010 Ford Fusion
PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:01 am
JetAeroBurner wrote:I wish to end this split pay.


OK. You picked a tough one. There are about three or four ways of doing that. None of them are easy.

Split pay (tip credit pay) is allowed by federal and most state laws. So, you'd need to organize many hundreds of thousands of people to change either the Federal law, or the State law.

The third way is to unionize your store or company and negotiate better wages. No one has ever successfully unionized a pizza store and made any positive changes, let alone negotiate better pay.

The fourth way is to negotiate better pay for you as an individual or as a class action lawsuit somehow. To do that, you'd need to collect information about how your mileage reimbursement pay is too low and therefore does not cover your actual or estimated vehicle expenses (which would be a minimum wage violation), and then file and win a lawsuit (a one to 5 year process) and get your full minimum wage paid back in the lawsuit. Chances are that you will NOT change the pay rates going forward, but only get back the money lost during the period covered by the lawsuit.
"If you ain't on the road, you ain't makin' money!" - gregster

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Formally employed by a Papa Johns Franchise in Washington state.
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Car you drive:
One with an internal combustion engine
PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 6:48 pm
Gregster wrote:Oh, and if you DO decide to fight back, it might be best if you posted under a pseudonym or 'fake name'. That way you do not 'telegraph' to your store or company what actions you are planning to take. If you decide to change your name here, just send me a PM with your new desired 'screen name'.

I cannot stress this enough. Some of us have already outed ourselves and we prefer it that way. But it is best to stay as anonymous as possible until you've built trust with the people you are speaking with on the internet.

Gregster wrote:Take a deep breath and realize that most of this is a slow lengthy process, and YOU will become the one who does most of the work if you choose to act. That said, there are PLENTY of well informed people here more than willing to help anyone who is willing to learn and help themselves.

Another thing that cannot be stressed enough. You will be learning on your own and with the help of the members of this forum. Some of them, like myself, have filed legal complaints against their employers for various issues that occur in our daily work life.


JetAeroBurner wrote:I wish to end this split pay.

Tough one to crack, as Gregster has already pointed out. The law allows the employer to pay you at this rate, and changing that is going to be highly unlikely.

As Gregster mentioned, your best bet is to address your mileage reimbursement. This is something we can definitely help you with, at least with education; considering I addressed this issue with my employers and successfully increase the franchise's mileage reimbursement rate by nearly 66% (with the help of other drivers in my franchise and with much help from Gregster's education).
Don't expect others to fight your Battles

n00b
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:46 pm

Where do you work?:
Pizza Hut
User Type:
Pizza Delivery Driver
Car you drive:
Compact Car
PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:32 pm
elric92 wrote:
Gregster wrote:Oh, and if you DO decide to fight back, it might be best if you posted under a pseudonym or 'fake name'. That way you do not 'telegraph' to your store or company what actions you are planning to take. If you decide to change your name here, just send me a PM with your new desired 'screen name'.

I cannot stress this enough. Some of us have already outed ourselves and we prefer it that way. But it is best to stay as anonymous as possible until you've built trust with the people you are speaking with on the internet.

Gregster wrote:Take a deep breath and realize that most of this is a slow lengthy process, and YOU will become the one who does most of the work if you choose to act. That said, there are PLENTY of well informed people here more than willing to help anyone who is willing to learn and help themselves.

Another thing that cannot be stressed enough. You will be learning on your own and with the help of the members of this forum. Some of them, like myself, have filed legal complaints against their employers for various issues that occur in our daily work life.


JetAeroBurner wrote:I wish to end this split pay.

Tough one to crack, as Gregster has already pointed out. The law allows the employer to pay you at this rate, and changing that is going to be highly unlikely.

As Gregster mentioned, your best bet is to address your mileage reimbursement. This is something we can definitely help you with, at least with education; considering I addressed this issue with my employers and successfully increase the franchise's mileage reimbursement rate by nearly 66% (with the help of other drivers in my franchise and with much help from Gregster's education).
Mileage reimbursement is a good idea. I know it will be difficult but driver's are the only one's using their own personal expenses for the business and its because of this, that I believe they're wrongly having their pay deducted. Insiders, who don't have to pay a dime to serve the company, get the 7.25 and we get 4.25... What if I were to bring up the fact that mileage reimbursement is good, but can it, plus maybe tips and minimum wage, afford to have you save for a new car? We kill our cars slowly everyday and increase the likely hood of wear and tear. How about you, drivers? Are you capable of saving on the side as a single home/apartment owner? So guys, I hate to ask this, but my ADHD doesn't help in the goal of processing. If it is possible to change the law for the better of drivers and their well being, could you give it to me step by step? I need to take one breadth at a time...
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Master Driver
Posts: 6999
Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2009 10:40 pm
Location: Chesapeake, VA
Where do you work?:
Papa John's franchise
User Type:
Pizza Delivery Driver
Car you drive:
2010 Ford Fusion
PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 6:10 pm
JetAeroBurner wrote:What if I were to bring up the fact that mileage reimbursement is good, but can it, plus maybe tips and minimum wage, afford to have you save for a new car?


Bring it up to who? What would they say if you did?

JetAeroBurner wrote:If it is possible to change the law for the better of drivers and their well being, could you give it to me step by step?


Step one: Convince your state lawmakers to make tip credit illegal in your state.
Step two: Get the Governor to sign the law.

or

Step one: Convince the House and Senate lawmakers to make tip credit illegal nationwide.
Step two: Get the President to sign the law.

Easy, right?

Here's a little history so you can see what you are up against:

History of the FLSA Minimum Wage and Tip Credit Laws

History of MINIMUM WAGE AND TIP CREDIT in Washington State

History: The Employer "Tip Credit"

Three great articles here:
"If you ain't on the road, you ain't makin' money!" - gregster

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