DON'T RESIST ROBBERY, CHICAGO STUDY WARNS

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:20 pm
Credit for finding this to one of the most knowledgeable friends I know: Ronnoc from TTPG.

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December 11, 1984
DON'T RESIST ROBBERY, CHICAGO STUDY WARNS

http://www.nytimes.com/1984/12/11/scien ... warns.html

Resisting an armed robber drastically increases the risk of death to the victim, according to results from a new study done at the University of Chicago.

While victims actively resisted in only 7 percent of the robberies studied, those incidents accounted for 51 percent of the deaths.


The study was done by Franklin E. Zimring, a professor at the University of Chicago Law School, and James J. Zuehl, a lecturer there. They analyzed nearly 1,000 robberies that were reported to the Chicago police in the course of a year. Ninety- five of the robberies ended in the death of a victim.

The study also found that robbers who used guns increased the risk of death to their victims far more than did those who used other weapons, such as knives. Guns accounted for three times as many deaths as knives, the next most dangerous weapon.

Robberies of stores and banks were about eight times more lethal than street robberies, a fact the researchers attributed to the more frequent use of guns and the higher frequency of resistance by victims in those settings.

Women suffered violence in robberies much less often than men, seemingly because they offered active resistance less often, and because they were probably seen as less threatening by the robber.

''The victim's refusal to cooperate with the offender generates a contest of wills,'' which explains the extraordinarily high rate of violence in those cases, the researchers said in their report, ''Victim Injury and Death in Urban Robbery,'' available from Mr. Zuehl.

In a robbery, the authors conclude, ''The correct answer to the implicit question of your money or your life is, provide the money.''
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:07 pm
Or it could be that in those 7% of cases that the victim resisted because they knew they weren't going to get away from the thug... There's not enough data to reach the conclusions of the study.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 2:14 am
I think the findings are credible. It is my belief that if a robber comes into the store without some kind of face covering that you are probably in greater danger. And the Pizza places I have worked at seem not to regard employees safety by having silent alarms in several key locations. In my current store only the managers seem to be given instructions on how to activate the silent alarm.

Is it unthinkable to take the role of helping the robber by showing where the safe is and who knows how to open it. Would that make me an accomplice instead of just being concerned about everyone going home that night?
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:37 pm
That's a bunch of bull stuff. I don't care what the statistics are. It is MY LIFE. If someone points a gun at me and promises not to shoot me if I give up the cash, agree to rape, take a beating, etc, YOU ARE TRUSTING A THUG TO KEEP A PROMISE!!! Can you trust him to keep a promise? My life is far too precious to trust a thug to keep a promise. I'd rather trust my shooting abilities.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 11:11 am
drjoker wrote:That's a bunch of bull stuff. I don't care what the statistics are. It is MY LIFE. If someone points a gun at me and promises not to shoot me if I give up the cash, agree to rape, take a beating, etc, YOU ARE TRUSTING A THUG TO KEEP A PROMISE!!! Can you trust him to keep a promise? My life is far too precious to trust a thug to keep a promise. I'd rather trust my shooting abilities.


After reading the driver memorials, I'm applying for my concealed carry license. I already have a handgun, and because current laws allow me to carry it in the vehicle without a concealed permit, I haven't received one. However, a handgun in the vehicle does me no good when I cannot legally carry it to and from the door on a delivery, so it's time to change the equation.

I'm just a year away from sitting for my state boards, and then I'll be moving on into the medical field and leaving this job behind. I have a wife and six month old baby, invested so much time and money in my education, and have no desire to take a bullet for a $15.00 bank and a couple pizzas when I can at least level the playing field with the thugs.

Funny thing is, if I shoot a robber in self defense right now, I could be charged with a felony for illegally carrying a firearm. Never mind that the actions of the thug precipitated the shooting, I'd be headed off to jail along with him and would never be able to obtain any type of medical licensing. It seems the legal system currently favors the robbers, because they have no fears of losing future employment due to a criminal record or worries about illegally carrying firearms.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 11:58 am
chicago is full of idiots, why would anyone take their legal advice seriously?

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:05 am
drjoker wrote:That's a bunch of bull stuff. I don't care what the statistics are. It is MY LIFE. If someone points a gun at me and promises not to shoot me if I give up the cash, agree to rape, take a beating, etc, YOU ARE TRUSTING A THUG TO KEEP A PROMISE!!! Can you trust him to keep a promise? My life is far too precious to trust a thug to keep a promise. I'd rather trust my shooting abilities.


This right here. Who's to say the robber isn't some sadist that would find some joy in killing / severely harming you? The robber is all ready crazy enough to wave a gun around and say "Give me the money or your life".

And we all know what the police will do. "CALL UP THE CSI! Now let's go grab some coffee and get some paperwork done!"

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:36 pm
Does the study say HOW the people resisted? I'll bet it wasn't with a gun since it is virtually impossible to legally own a firearm in Chicago. Only the criminals there have them. And despite their rigid gun control they have a soaring murder rate - with firearms.

I'll bet if the resistors had some firepower behind them it would be a different story.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:40 pm
pastpizza wrote:Does the study say HOW the people resisted? I'll bet it wasn't with a gun since it is virtually impossible to legally own a firearm in Chicago. Only the criminals there have them. And despite their rigid gun control they have a soaring murder rate - with firearms.

I'll bet if the resistors had some firepower behind them it would be a different story.


We should find out soon since the handgun ban was recently overturned.
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